![WARFRAME Wiki](data:image/svg+xml,<svg xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg" width="500" height="500"><rect fill-opacity="0"/></svg>)
|
 3  50
|
Thermal Sunder Siphon kinetic energy from the area, charging the battery and inflicting Introduced in Update 25.7 (2019-08-29) |
| ||||
| Subsumable to Helminth |
Info
- Gauss expends
50 energy to manipulate the kinetic energy around him to create an area of extreme temperatures with an initial radius of ![AbilityRangeBuff](data:image/svg+xml,<svg xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2000/svg" width="32" height="32"><rect fill-opacity="0"/></svg>)
6 / 8 / 10 / 12 meters, which gradually shrinks to a final radius of 3 / 4 / 5 / 6 meters and lasts for 6 / 9 / 12 / 15 seconds.
- Tap the ability key (default 3 ) to absorb kinetic energy, charging battery power by 10% to inflict a Cold proc on all enemies within range, lasting for 2.5 - 5 / 3 - 6 / 3.5 - 7 / 4 - 8 seconds based on battery. Enemies caught in the area creation receive 75 - 375 / 100 - 500 / 125 - 625 / 150 - 750 Cold damage based on battery with guaranteed Status Effect; enemies lingering inside the area also receive damage per second, which diminishes in amount with the size of the area. When cast on enemies already affected by Cold proc, they receive 9 additional Cold status procs to be instantly frozen solid for the full status duration.
- Hold down the ability key to expend kinetic energy, draining battery power by 10% to inflict a Heat proc on all enemies in range, lasting for a minimum duration of 2.5 - 5 / 3 - 6 / 3.5 - 7 / 4 - 8 seconds based on battery. Enemies caught in the area creation receive 150 - 750 / 200 - 1000 / 250 - 1250 / 300 - 1500 Heat damage based on battery with guaranteed Status Effect; enemies lingering inside the area also receive damage per second, which diminishes in amount with the size of the area. When cast on enemies already affected by Heat proc, Thermal Sunder deals its normal damage plus the damage of the current Heat proc[1].
- Damage per second has a moderate chance to stagger light enemy units within the area.
- Enemies already afflicted with a status effect of the same type will have it reapplied; its status duration uses the battery power level at the time of the new Thermal Sunder cast.
- Tap the ability key (default 3 ) to absorb kinetic energy, charging battery power by 10% to inflict a
- Casting Thermal Sunder of the opposite damage type on enemies already afflicted with Cold or Heat procs, combines the damage type into Blast. Affected enemies first have the initial status effect removed, receive the new status effect, they also receive a Blast proc and deals damage based on the mode being used plus the damage of the canceled status.
- Blast damage is given by :
- For example: Casting a Heat Thermal Sunder at 80% battery followed by a Cold Thermal Sunder at 70% battery with 6 seconds left on the Heat proc will deal: [300 + 0.8 * (1500 - 300)] * 6 + [150 + 0.7 * (750 - 150)] = 8,130 damage.
- At 100% battery with Redline, this formula can be simplified if the ability is recasted immediately: (12000 * Ability Duration + 750) * Ability Strength
- At 100% battery with Redline, this formula can be simplified if the ability is recasted immediately: (12000 *
- The order in which the elemental procs are combined changes the direction in which enemies within the ability area are knocked back by the Blast proc. Casting Cold first then Heat will knock enemies outwards, while casting Heat first then Cold will pull enemies in towards the player.
- When casting both elements, the elemental proc cast second will override and replace the first element already present, e.g. if enemies were affected by the Cold area first, casting Heat proc on them will remove the Cold proc and replace it with Heat.
- Ability Synergy:
Mach Rush through a Thermal Sunder area to add its Cold or Heat damage to Mach Rush's knockdown and shockwave explosion.- Thermal Sunder gains bonuses to its status effects when
Redline is active and above the redline battery charge (>80%):
- Cold mode applies 10 Cold status procs to instantly freeze enemies solid.
- Heat mode's damage is doubled. This doubling is applied after the bonus damage from active heat procs on a target, allowing consecutive casts to do double the previous cast's damage.
- The Blast proc permanently reduces enemy's current amount of armor based off of battery power level, up to a maximum of 100% with a full battery charge, before inflicting its damage.
- Armor reduction scales linearly from 0% armor reduction at 80% battery to 100% armor reduction at 100% battery.
- Can be recast while active to create new Cold or Heat sunder areas. Gauss may create up to 4 distinct areas of either element, resulting in only 8 total distinct areas active at once. Casting Thermal Sunder in a new area after reaching the maximum of Heat or Cold areas will remove the oldest area of corresponding element.
- Subsuming Gauss to the Helminth will offer Thermal Sunder and its augments to be used by other Warframes.
See Also[]
Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet
24 comments
I would like to add something about this :
"When cast on enemies already affected by Heat proc, Thermal Sunder deals its normal damage plus the damage of the current Heat proc[1]."
-When the first tick is done by a weapon modded with faction dmg. (e.g. if a weapon has x1.55 faction mod, instead of adding the tick damage to the subsequent Thermal Sunder, it will remove this bonus before calculation).
-Works perfectly fine when the heat proccer is only modded with bonus Heat.
-Also Heat Inherit works as expected afterwards (i.e uses both faction bonus and heat bonus from the inital heat proccer) and the Thermal Sunder ability damage is used where "modded based damage" would be in the heat status formula
Spaghetti is a fine dish
Maybe add something about Archon Vitality as well.
Anyone know if the x10 cap subsume kills the Heat Expedite?
Looks like it did
Reading through the article and the comments I was very confused about how does the armor stripping works on Gauss so I did some testing and it actually depends on how high your battery level is above 80%.
Initially I thought it reliead on the entirety of the battery level like having 85% battery meant 85% armor strip but that didn't work. Then I thought it relied on the "Redline counter" (check the Redline skill article for what Redline counter means), but apparently Thermal Sunder does not depend on it for armor stripping.
Testing at low 80% battery level it stripped away very little armor, testing at high 90% it strips away a lot of armor regardless of the "Redline counter".
So I'd say the armor strip is calculated like this:
82% battery = 10% armor strip
85% battery = 35% armor strip
90% battery = 50% armor strip
95% battery = 75% armor strip
100% battery = 100% armor strip
So just check the Battery gauge itself to see how much armor you will strip as it now makes a lot more sense to me why the gauge's head (80-100% of the battery gauge) is so much bigger the rest of the gauge.
Then it should be obvious that hitting 100% "Redline counter" will help you keep your armor strip at 100% as it will keep your battery level maxed out.
However if you just activated Redline and your "Redline counter" is very low you can still full armor strip if you push your battery level to full and hit Cold+Heat Thermal Sunder combo.
Tip: If you want to fully armor strip with Thermal Sunder without hitting 100% "Redline counter" I recommend you use corrosive projection to drop the battery level requirement from 100% down to 96.4%, this small buffer will make it a lot easier to fully strip armor as the Redline skill drains battery overtime.
U34
"Changed the Thermal Sunder Helminth ability to have an altered attribute of “Scaling from Heat Status on enemies capped to 10x ability damage.”
"A deeper dive into its Subsumed version on other Warframes showed us there was a Damage Over Time issue where Heat procs were scaling with unlimited exponential damage, therefore, we have implemented the cap."
Seems like they nerfed the subsumed version by capping its damage.
Nerfing Thermal Sunder subsume before Nourish when they said that one was the most subsumed ability by far, yeah makes sense...
I mean, this seems pretty reasonable, it definitely doesn't make the ability useless for other frames, it just limits how highly you can scale your damage.
So now, if you want to do the funny "clap clap clap level 9999 mapwide nuke" strat, it's best to use the frame that the ability came from for it and to use it with the battery, instead of it just being available for literally any frame to do.
Thermal Sunder helminth is still good, it just has a capped exponential damage scaling, don't forget that it also has a really good augment.
As for Thermal Sunder vs Nourish, Nourish is a support ability that gives everyone on the team more energy, added viral damage, and a single viral proc on enemies within a radius that hit you, vs Thermal Sunder, which is a nuking ability that can clear in a very wide radius, very quickly, especially at lower levels where it doesn't even need to scale very highly to kill instantly.
Generally, when faced with either nerfing a teamwide support ability that helps your squad cast abilities more and do more damage, or nerfing a nuke ability that basically prevents anyone else in the squad from being able to play the game by killing every enemy in the next 2 rooms, regardless of which is stronger in your opinion, it makes sense that TS was nerfed before Nourish.
Having every frame be able to do such a strong nuke that scaled so infinitely, would be worse for the game's health than letting people buff their allies, if that makes sense.
Whichever you think is stronger, the problem with Nourish is that it's such a good support ability that it drowns out the other kinda mediocre support options in Helminth, except Gloom.
The problem with TS was that if one person in the squad was running it, no one could play the game and it scaled infinitely.
Just putting a cap on how high it can scale is honestly a pretty minor nerf all things considered.
To the essay above me, about thermal:
The clap clap clap level cap nuke only exist unless you spend like insane amounts of time clapping, like over 20 times or more, which is pretty much unsustainable even you are Garuda or harrow due to the kill speed just ain't it.
The cap was given for one reason, people thought garudas and harrows are abusing the shet out of it, yet not knowing that a frame that is so unlikely to be a nuker, suddenly breaking level cap with just 5 claps with primer, in SP circuit its even more crazy, everyone just ded.
All you need to make thermal suddenly become the god of destruction, is just as simple as having a roar buff, and a primer.
The worst offender wasn't even the garudas or harrows, it was Rhino, all along.
Roar with thermal is in unholy levels of broken that:
Normal 300str thermal shall deal 2700 at first, 5400 at 2nd, 10800 at 3rd and so on.
With a primer, due to synergies, the multiplier of 2x will suddenly become (2 x 2)x, which is 4x,
Thus 2700 10800 43200 169600...
Now add in 150% roar, 2700 becomes 6750 at base, you'd expect that this goes to 13600, right? NAH. Its 23625. Why? 2x multiplier? We already in (2 + roar%) = 3.5x multiplier.
Add in primer, you'd expect a 2 x 2= 4? How about 3.5 x 3.5 = 12.25x per clap?
The dmg can goes from 6750 to 82,688 and then 1,012,922 and then 12,408,293....with no viral stacks, add those in the doubled heat DoTs and massively boosted DoT dmg, and oh my god just what have I created.
Thermal Sunder Rhino is so unholy that I am even scared to share it to others, as it will simply ruin the whole game by existing, the abomination I witnessed. If there is a thermal in squad, and Rhino exist, the game's basically GG, too EZ.
I know this will inevitably be nerfed but it's just funny watching my heat procs go from tickling a level 180 SP CHG to heat procs that could burn gods alive.
Thermal Sunder indeed did get nerfed (it got damage capped)
Ah well. It was inevitable.
It only got capped on subsume not on gauss himself
I am aware. Was inevitable.
Thermal sunder is now probably the strongest nuke in the game. Load up with archon vitality, max range base strength so as not to kill his kit, and certainly some efficiency.
Nuke can kill even level cap enemies this way. Steel path are only 2 casts of heat and a cold away from death while it's scaling potential continues to bring it higher exponentially with each cast. Other frames can utilize it better at lower levels for ESO nuke (harrow or rhino) but it has no competition when on gauss.
Hope so, too many garuda's spamming this ability nonstop in pubs
Could you share a clip of someone killing level cap enemies with this? Not too familiar with thermal sunder and all its intricacies.
For Rhino (and kullervo), it depends, its basically a trade off.
Rhino has one of the most absurd scaling with thermal due to just how fast thermal ramps up in dmg per cast due to exponential triple dip scaling.
ESO nuke? Wave 14+ be like: Haha clap clap clap gameplay
In base to 1hr steel path, you essentially just kill faster vs a Gauss, with 100% uptime, once got a near 160kpm-165kpm with rhino thermal build.
And kullervo...collective curse. This ability itself is just batshet insane with thermal sunder.
Both can clap level cap enemies to ded in just 6-7 claps. If both duo together...Cant wait to see the combined scaling of roar + collective curse into thermal sunder, both have exceptionally insane scaling on its own already, let alone together...
But still, Gauss use this as well as both of them or better in long endurance, since it has armor strip intact for the nuke, but only when battery is full...
Oh wait...Rhino thermal + torment twofold perk in duviri....quadruple exponential dip scaling incoming...
Cute, but (unfortunately) you're better off just replacing it with Energized Munitions and shooting a Kuva Zarr 20 times into a room before anything has any time to react. If DE ever makes armor strip relevant again by nerfing the Hunter Munitions + giga AoE primaries combo, this could go back to being interesting.
It is certainly fun when you can do both though. :)
That just happened last patch. Cursed comment
Resistances stripping and Grindframe
This ability with Gauss + Redline alone destroyed a bunch of lvl 150 sentients on the Steel Path Lua with blast procs after the Sentient Status changes. I wasn't running Ability Strength either .
Nullifiers instantly negate this ability making it impossible to use when one is around, so it's not that great vs corpus and corrupted.
Then Kill the Nullifiers before they reach you, not very hard
^
Bro this is the Warframe Community. Anything that requires +2 button presses and/or active thought for more than 1 second they don't consider it 'viable' or part of the meta.
Good thing Gauss' 4 makes gun shoot fast.
Shoot fast, kill bubble, clap clap, dead.
Bug, watched myself get slowly killed by my own heat sunder in the simulacrum.
I was told this can damage enemies through the rift. Is it true? I don't have Gauss so can someone confirm this for me? Thanks in advance
Thx, but what about cc abilities that deal no damage like Petrify?
All abilities, except Limbo's own abilities, ignore the Rift entirely.
Except mirage's clones, those don't work because who cares about mirage (they count as ability to steal your affinity and not proc arcanes/buffs tho)
I didn't know that, but does make sense. Do the clones have the ability to hit Arby Shield Drones?
They may count as weapon multishot or something else weapon based.
3rd last line of the "Misc:" part when you select the Heat section in the ability header card is missing a parenthesis. It should be "100% (<heat icon> Heat ignite chance from Redline)" but the current line is missing the opening parenthesis so it reads "100% <heat icon> Heat ignite chance from Redline)"
Does anyone know what does the buff called "thermal sunder" that pops from time to time actually does? does it just display the amout of damage you'll deal with the next blast proc? then why does it not shows up most of the time?
"Mach Rush through a Thermal Sunder area to add its Cold or Heat damage to Mach Rush's knockdown and shockwave explosion."
Woah. I never knew Blast AoEs fully removed Armor. Is it worth it to have a build with max range, duration minus narrow minded and no strength mods? I assume armor stripping removes the purpose of damage from blast areas....
I know that redline boost strength depends on duration...
Redlines bonuses and armor strip is unaffected by strength, only thing in his kit affected by strength is the damage of his abilities, and how much Damage Reduction you get from Kinetic Plating.
the only AOE spam nuke subsume
The damage only stacks linearly without access to Redline, since the damage-doubling effect is only active during Redline. It doesn't scale too well when used on other frames, but it still is certainly the best subsumed AoE nuke.
edit: didn't realize it does the damage of the current heat proc + the new damage when recast on enemies affected by a heat proc; I guess it scales better than I thought... I have to test this more
The significant thing is that you can put it on Warframes that it wasn't designed to be on who can spam it more than Gauss ever could. On Gauss it's not that strong but when you are Inaros or Harrow and you have no battery to drain and energy out the ass you can have huge range and blind rage and spam it all day and it becomes pretty decent.
I have several problems with this, on harrow it's trash compared to gauss. You don't have the armor strip, and you lose out on well over half your damage. Gauss adds all that on top of his already S tier kit. No, using it on other frames over gauss for anything but the energy that harrow provides is idiotic at best. On Gauss you can cast 2 heat with 40% strength and archon vitality and it can flat out one-shot steel path enemies.
People, read the goddamn description and stop making inane questions that answer themselves. Armor strip happens when both in Redline and above 80% battery, two things that it cannot ever have as a subsumed ability.
does the armor strip work on subsumed ablities?
Well, it applies the Heat proc, and that's what does the armor strip with said ability.
No, although heat procs strip armor, this ability can permanently strip up to 100% of an enemy's armor IF Gauss' battery is above 80% (which means redline is also active) and both versions of the ability are used in the same area (causing blast damage).
Due to the requirements for the armor stripping, it does not happen if subsumed on another warframe
How is this as a subsumed ability? Still freeze enemies solid with a double tap? does it have the armor strip?
Apparently it acts as if you had 50% battery all the time, so double tap to freeze and no armor strip other than heat procs
The Blast proc permanently strips away the enemy's current amount of armor based off of battery power level, up to a maximum of 100% with a full battery charge, before inflicting its damage.
Meaning it should strip 50% of armor.
Oh wait, should've read that bit above it, that only works when redline is active and over 80%, so yea, no armor strip
Can anyone confirm how the public version works? Does it act as if there's zero battery?
The damage appears to be sort of averaged out, showing defaults for 450 cold damage, 900 heat damage, and 6 seconds of status duration.
Is the radius for this purely horizontal?
In otherwords, is there any way to affect the height of the Thermal Sunder effect to hit enemies that might be above the plane on which you cast the ability?
(Or below)
should be spherical